"the Ventures sound - that light fuzz, what is it?"

[Veenture]

Happening to visit the Telecaster Forum today I just came across an interesting discussion (a few years back now) about:

"the Ventures sound - that light fuzz, what is it?"

see: http://www.tdpri.com/forum/stomp-box/64 ... -what.html

Wanting to take the discussion a bit further, I thought it only fitting to do so here on our very own Mosrite Forum.

Now, although the custom made fuzzbox for Nokie (by Red Rhodes) is mentioned, there doesn't seem to be a satisfactory answer to the question remaining still with many a guitar player (including myself) wanting to emulate "that light fuzz" which is so prominent in the Ventures’ albums “THE FABULOUS VENTURES”, “WALK, DON'T RUN - VOL.2”, “KNOCK ME OUT !”, “LIVE IN JAPAN ‘65”, “VENTURES A GO-GO”.

This “light fuzz sound” is clearly very different to the “heavy” fuzz sound you can hear on the Ventures’ album “WILD THINGS” -where surely an actual fuzz pedal must have been used (or possibly built into the amp). Don’t you agree Ventures fans?

Upon further reading said discussion, it seems that many folks are looking for ‘that sound’ in the wrong place...after all, none of the fuzzboxes mentioned there seemed to fit the bill.

Get this: to my utter amazement and pleasant surprise I came pretty close to that “light fuzz sound”…only yesterday…and guess what…WITHOUT the use of my FUZZRite clone! (by Ashbass).

I was simply driving my Hallmark 60 Custom through my Fender “Custom” Vibrolux Reverb RI amp (tube) …and there it was…that so desirable overdriven sound while doing a handful of Ventures songs! -wowzzzers, “ESCAPE” turned out particularly nice! (I think I mentioned getting a "Nokie feeling" -in the Hallmark 60 Custom thread).

Why I hadn’t noticed this before? well, not being at home it was my first real opportunity to turn up the volume on the amp! I can’t remember the exact settings but I did have a tad echo in the mix (not the amp's reverb btw) and the volume on the Hallmark NOT full throttle.

I did not get the same results with my Fender AVRI ’57 Stratocaster which I took along as well -for the Shadows tunes. It has to be a Mosrite (or equivalent) because of the stronger pups!

= how I feel

Paul

[Dennisthe Menace]

Paul,
I recall reading (somewhere ) that Nokie's recorded sound was done in the Studio by setting the Gain Level higher
than normal to achieve that 'Peach Fuzz' sound. And of course the hot pickups generated that 'chalky midrange tone.'
On the WDR '64 VOL II, it is most noticeable on the tunes such as: Peach Fuzz, Diamond Head, Pedal Pusher, and of
course, Walk Don't Run '64 .

[Veenture]

Hey Dennis, what you say does not surprise me at all now after my 'discovery' yesterday.
I agree with your findings too and thanks for the feedback

[dubtrub]

Hey Paul, you're too use to playing those clean sterile amps. Blues players get that sound all the time by driving the amp just slightly over the edge into the early breakup. That's why those Tweed Deluxe amps from 50's and modern clones are so popular. You can get the 'over driven' sound at lower volumes.

[Strat-o-rama]

Paul,
Your Custom Vibrolux Reverb is designed for an early break up as well. It is one of the reasons it is "Custom". Combine this with the hot pick ups of the Hallmark, and you've got that "touch of fuzz".
BTW, if you want more clean headroom out of the "Custom" Vibrolux, there is a mod that can be done that turns it into a '63 Vibroverb RI (now discontinued). Also, a lot of players using the "CVR" replace the speakers (Eminence 'Ragin' Cajun's seem to be all the rage right now) and mod the preamp circuit to eliminate the negative feedback loop, which eliminates much of that amps signature hiss, giving a little more headroom, but still getting good breakup at gigging levels.
I don't know where these people gig, because you are talking about break-up occuring right around 6 on the volume, and that's a 40 watt amp. Earplugs will be handed out at the door.
Danny, you have one of the '63 Vibroverb RIs, right? At what point do you start to get some grit with your Strat, and then with your Mosrites?

[64sunburst]

Dennis, so you mean the gain on the recording console and not the amp? That makes sense to me because that "peach fuzz" tone never quite sounded like an overdriven amp to me, and it was too light to be a fuzz box, but boosting the gain on the recorder sounds more plausable. I mean I'm sure you can approximate that tone by driving the amp like Paul mentioned, but that "peach fuzz" sounds like something quite different.

Byron

[Dennisthe Menace]

Dennis, so you mean the gain on the recording console and not the amp? That makes sense to me because that "peach fuzz" tone never quite sounded like an overdriven amp to me, and it was too light to be a fuzz box, but boosting the gain on the recorder sounds more plausable. I mean I'm sure you can approximate that tone by driving the amp like Paul mentioned, but that "peach fuzz" sounds like something quite different.
Byron

Byron,
Sorry, yeah that's what I meant to say.....not necessarily setting the level of the Console Board 'beyond the point of no return,'
but more of just pushing it 'into the red' to get that....dare I say it? Not to sound repititious, but....'Peach Fuzz.'

[Veenture]

Hey guys, great 'fuzz' feedback!
Trent, I've read about the mod that can be done that turns it into a '63 Vibroverb RI and after having read it, I sorely wished I had a '63 Vibroverb instead. I don't know how it is with the quality, expertise and dedication of doing mods in Holland but if I ever find a guy who can do it -faithfully according to the mod guidelines- I might just go for it. I copied the mod description onto my hard disc
Thanks for all the tips. (no gigging yet, we were just having a 'get-together' in a hired sound insulated room of a guitar shop we frequented before our band broke up; it was just the three of us -lead, rhythm and drums (no bass )

[thunderhead]

Try a Fulltone Fulldrive II Pedal. It is the most Transparent overdrive I ever used. It will do wonders to a single Channel Amp, give you essentially Three Chanels. It goes from slight break up to Heavy Gain and all points in between.

[dubtrub]

Danny, you have one of the '63 Vibroverb RIs, right? At what point do you start to get some grit with your Strat, and then with your Mosrites?

On my '63 reissue Vibroverb, I have changed the phase inverter tube V6 which allows a little more headroom before it starts to break up. I rarely play it loud enough to get it to breakup as it doesn't start until around 6 or 7, but it can easily go all the way to 10 and still sounds really great. The tube chart calls for an 12AX7 in V6, but I changed it to a lesser value lower gain 12AT7. Before with the 12AX7, breakup would start around 4 and lost it's musical appeal around 6-7, after that it sounded like crap.

Regarding the Custom Vibrolux. It is the same basic amp as the Vibroverb so why did Fender change it to something that needs to be modified right out of the box? I would highly recommend the modification on the Custom Vibrolux Reverb. It's really not a difficult upgrade.

Here's a link to the Vibrolux mods to Vibroverb.