Leveling Frets

[panther]

Can someone explain, in some detail, the geometry behind Fret Leveling.
I understand, the strings need to be removed. Now here is where I get confused. I remove the strings, and do my thing to level the Frets.
Now I've got the frets level, up and down the neck. Now I put strings on the guitar, and have a slight bow to the neck, doesn't that make the frets UNLEVEL again ?
Dan

[101Volts]

Adding tension to the neck puts relief (Forward bow) in the neck which can be adjusted out with the truss rod, If desired. A little relief doesn't ruin a fret leveling.

Austin

[olrocknroller]

Before I start leveling the frets, I always ensure that the truss rod is adjusted so that the neck is perfectly flat. I have a special slotted ruler that fits over the frets, and shows me when the fretboard is flat. Then I support the neck so that it doesn't flex with each pass of the leveling file. If I know of a high fret, I will mark the adjacent frets with a marking pen, so that when I reach the correct height, I begin to remove material from the adjacent frets...this tells me I have "arrived", and it is time to start re-crowning and smoothing.

Now all the frets are exactly the same height above the fretboard. At this point, string up the guitar, and set the amount of relief you want.

Duzzat help?

[panther]

The making sure the fretboard is flat now makes all the difference in how it all works.
Dan

[ludobag]

it is the most important to have the fretboard relly flat before beguin the dressing
an advise when you dress them don't apply on the neck cause if is already carve you can put on the neck a bow
and after the dressing will be not good
use a marker to write on top of each fret to see if you take material equally (mask the fretboard also)
the harder is to follow the radius with the straight edge with sand paper glued on it
i use 2 grit first something like 240 grit and on the other side 600
with the 240 it go really fast to have all the fret dress and with the 6oo you have less marks
but carefull even with 6oo it go fast
the most important too is to have a nice move ,let the sand paper work do not apply more on one side
if you feel it seems not straight as you would use a straight edge too to look at where is bump or hole and don't hesitate to re written with marker to look if you take on all fret

[TerryTNM]

Here's my approach;
As others have said, start with the fingerboard perfectly straight and flat.
I'll see how level and straight the frets are before it's strung up. With just a snug turn of the truss rod, I take the beam straight edge (2 1/2 X 1 X24 milled straight edge) with a piece of 400 grit paper, tack glued to the 1" side and do a primary level of the frets to the lowest common fret. (I rarely use a file.) Without crowning or smoothing, bring the strings up to tension. Check for straightness by holding down any string at the 1st fret and the 15th. The space or lack of space under the string between those 2 points reveals if you need to add any more tension to the truss rod. Set the action for what ever you like. Play the the thing. . . hear if you have any buzzing going on. How hard you attack the strings is directly related to string buzz if your frets are level. When you are satisfied, take the strings off and do a proper crowning and polishing.

Like you were saying, if you level the frets without the strings and then with the strings a slight bow has been pulled, the truss rod should bring it back to level again.

You also might want to take your guitar to some place that will Pleck it. Plecking is a computer analysis of the frets and their heights and radius that once scanned will then file and dress all the frets to their optimum. I've never had this done but it's fascinating to watch.

This is just the way I've been doing it. A good beam straight edge is quite important. . . for me anyway. -Good Luck


I'd like to add that gluing the fret board to the neck can cause the neck to back bow. It happens because the glue line expands. I've had to wait as much a 3 weeks for the neck to dry out straight. It happens with regular Titebond as well as epoxy. (hide glue is not supposed to have these properties but I don't use hide glue so. . . ) If you glued on the fingerboard and the neck was straight, check it out after you take the clamps off. You'll see that the neck now has a back bow. that will gradually decrease as the glue line drys. Trying to put in the frets and level it all out before the neck returns straight can be a problem. . . I'm just saying.

[ludobag]

to the backbow of neck du to gluing i contreact this with upper fretboard wet
cause the glue who is wet tend to bend the fretboard then if you wet the upper side less bend
more over when you clamp it you can make a bow if you clamp it on workbench not flat too

[panther]

Thank you all, very clear, and detailed information. Now I feel, I have a better understanding of how the process works.
Dan

[TerryTNM]

to the backbow of neck du to gluing i contreact this with upper fretboard wet
cause the glue who is wet tend to bend the fretboard then if you wet the upper side less bend
more over when you clamp it you can make a bow if you clamp it on workbench not flat too

I think there is something to be said about the glue line and the wetness. In the case of a water-based glue ie: Titebond, Elmers etc. there is an expectancy for expansion because of the water content. I tried to eliminate this by using 2 part epoxy with no water but the expansion still happens with the epoxy as well. As far as clamping I always use a clamping caul and my beam straight edge for gluing up. I just live with the physics of it now and wait for the curing process. Curiously I've never heard anyone mention this phenomenon before. Excellent topic.

[panther]

Using two part epoxy, instead of water to evaporate, it's then solvents. I would guess that solvent based glues, would be less likely to expand as much, as water based glue would.
Dan